Go Back   Forno Bravo Forum: The Wood-Fired Oven Community > Pizza Oven Design and Installation > Other Oven Types

Like Tree3Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-21-2013, 08:27 PM
Serf
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Ontario
Posts: 10
Default Will this design work?

I have a client who wants a Pizza oven with a separate firebox to keep the soot and ash out of the oven (yes I know the purists are going to complain about this but its what we wants!)

I have a design shown below. Do you think the oven will get hot enough?
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Bake Oven Option 2.pdf (503.7 KB, 242 views)
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-22-2013, 10:20 AM
SableSprings's Avatar
Apprentice
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Roseburg, OR USA
Posts: 193
Default Re: Will this design work?

If you Google masonry white ovens, you'll get a number of links to designs much like your client's drawing (Heat-Kit White Bakeoven link has some interesting info). From the "old data" I've seen, the white ovens were considered great for baking but their designs tended to keep hearth max temps in the 500F range. That temp is considered by many to be a little cool for "real" pizza...although it will work to bake almost anything else.

Several of "best" French bakeries that use wood or gas fired masonry ovens are still using white oven designs. The book "The Bread Builders" by Wing & Scott has some good info on them as well. Basically it comes down to the fact that white ovens are much more complex and difficult to build correctly than black ovens...also translating into much higher cost for a white oven. For those reasons, it seems that white ovens tend to be much bigger and are oriented to commercial use. To my understanding, most bakeries now use deck or rotary ovens because they are very good, reliable, and readily available.

That said, if you search this forum for "white ovens" you'll find several folks who have working home pizza ovens that use a white oven configuration/design and they have resolved most (if not all) of the compromise issues (such as high costs, venting, and temp).
__________________
Mike Stansbury
Roseburg, Oregon (
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
)

Photo albums

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by SableSprings; 05-22-2013 at 12:32 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-22-2013, 11:26 AM
Apprentice
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Bucks County, PA
Posts: 184
Default Re: Will this design work?

my initial thought is that you wont capture the amount of heat you want.. All of your heat is going right out the chimney. I can only guess that you might get the oven temp up to 400-500 degreesF. Just guessing,
brickie in oz likes this.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-22-2013, 01:46 PM
deejayoh's Avatar
Il Pizzaiolo
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,208
Default Re: Will this design work?

I'd recommend they use gas. That won't really be a pizza oven.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-22-2013, 02:35 PM
Faith In Virginia's Avatar
Master Builder
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Virginia
Posts: 720
Default Re: Will this design work?

I have been doing a lot of research on white ovens. Now this is just a guess on my part but I think the oven will get plenty hot. I saw a design very similar I'll see if I can't find it again...but this guy had his firebox directly under the oven floor like the picture you showed. Apparently the floor got so hot that he needed to cook on grates to keep his bread from burning.

The second thing you need to consider is cleaning. White ovens are filthy things when it comes to buildup in the heating chambers...so you need good access to them to scrape out the buildup.

I'll look for that oven

Faith

Edit found the oven http://www.pyromasse.ca/articles/Stanb_e.html

Last edited by Faith In Virginia; 05-22-2013 at 03:05 PM. Reason: found the link
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-22-2013, 04:21 PM
Serf
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Ontario
Posts: 10
Default Re: Will this design work?

Thanks for the info guys. Any wood fired oven is still nicer than gas!

I will look into the "white oven" but if you could post those drawings that would be great.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-22-2013, 04:28 PM
Serf
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Ontario
Posts: 10
Default Re: Will this design work?

The bake oven that I am asking about is going to be built into the old stone wall of a large stone ruin near Ottawa that we are stabilizing for a client. He is adding a fireplace, pool, hot tub and outdoor kitchen into the old building walls to create an outdoor patio. Pretty sweet!!

We just finished a "Rumford" fireplace in a different wall that I will post some pics of if your interested. The goal is to make the fireplace and bake oven look original.
Attached Thumbnails
Will this design work?-20130508_100515.jpg  
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-22-2013, 04:38 PM
Tscarborough's Avatar
Il Pizzaiolo
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Ausitn
Posts: 2,861
Default Re: Will this design work?

I doubt it would get hot enough for bread, much less pizza. If you want it to be authentic, is will be a black oven.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-22-2013, 05:46 PM
Journeyman
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Detroit
Posts: 383
Default Re: Will this design work?

My personal opinion is if you value your reputation you will direct the customer in a different direction, but if you MUST proceed in this fashion you need to make a few serious changes:

1. I would make the dome as low as physically possible. Using only radiant heat from the brick to cook the pizza you will need that heat as close to the top of the pie as possible.

2. Bring the heat into contact with the oven from the top. This fixes two issues. First, your proposed design breaks one of the main rules for this type of oven, never diverge flows that are ascending. Second, by bringing the heat in the top you will help the balance of heat.

I'm thinking something along the lines of a large firebox on the bottom that feeds into an insulated stack at the back. The heat rises up the stack and then diverges down around the oven. The flows converge under the floor of the oven and then leave via another vertical stack.
JGarcia likes this.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-22-2013, 06:15 PM
stonecutter's Avatar
Il Pizzaiolo
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: South Carolina,USA
Posts: 1,526
Default Re: Will this design work?

It won't work. Even if you have a raging fire burning in the FP at all hours, there is too much masonry absorbing the heat..and the oven itself will most likely never get any hotter than 300*-400*. Basically, you are designing a masonry heater, not an oven.
brickie in oz likes this.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Current WFO build -
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


When we build, let us think that we build for ever.
John Ruskin
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Russian oven design, unusual hearth floor. Turkish gambit Getting Started 0 02-04-2013 07:50 PM
vent design in this picture chale Design Styles, Chimneys and Finish 2 08-17-2010 09:24 AM
Gable house roof design dbhansen Design Styles, Chimneys and Finish 10 09-24-2009 03:36 PM
Hearth Design Freddie Getting Started 6 04-10-2009 02:01 PM
Pompei Oven Base in Winterland - Floating Design tdibratt Getting Started 1 07-09-2008 07:42 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:31 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
2006/10 Forno Bravo, LLC