San Francisco Style Sourdough Hearth Bread and Flatbread Discuss San Francisco Style Sourdough in the Brick Oven Cooking forums; Wow! great sourdough - very similar or better than what you get in most of San Francisco, in my humble ...

[MoonshineBaker]

Wow! great sourdough - very similar or better than what you get in most of San Francisco, in my humble opinion :-). I was gifted a San Francisco style sourdough starter last summer from Wild Flour Bakery in Freestone, California. ( Wild Flour Bread Bakery - Wood Fired Brick Oven Baked Bread - Wildflour Freestone ) I volunteered my service for a morning and was given their starter. I have used it over the last 8 months or so using the basic formula given in Alan Scott's "The Bread Builders". I got decent results with a chewy crust and an open crumb though overall the loaves were a bit heavy. I was using 80% Giusto's Baker's Choice and 20% rye flours at 67% hydration - 2% salt and 0.2% barley malt - with an over night pre-ferment that was 40-50% of the total dough weight- loaf weight = ~ 800 grams shaped as rounds- and baked at 450*F for 45-50 min. The people to whom I give the loaves say it's good flavor but a bit heavy; and I would agree. Today, as an experiment, I varied the formula as follows: 70% hydration, the pre-ferment/barm @ 40% of total dough weight, 50% King Arthur's All Purpose, 30% Giusto's Baker's Choice and 20% Giusto's Whole White Wheat Pastry Flour of the total flour weights, 2% Salt and no barley Malt as it is in the King Arthur's flour. I hand kneaded it for 10 minutes and finished it off in my Kitchen Aide with 2 minutes a a #2 setting. It was a very moist, sticky dough. I let it rise over 4-5 hours with one punching down per Hamelman at 65-70*F. I formed 3 loaves at 750 grams each. In a closed proofing box they rose for 3 hours. I docked it with a pair of very sharp kitchen scissors. In my FornoBravo wood fired oven, I baked the 3 loaves at ~450-475*F for 40 minutes - then 3-4 minutes with the oven door open for a cruncher crust. Great results: a nicely caramelized, crunchy crust, a nice crumb and best of all not the heavy, dense bread I was making using a heavier flour...duh! And a nice moderately tangy sourdough flavor. Any thoughts on what I've done are appreciated. Richard

[MoonshineBaker]

Here's a photo of the breads.

[gjbingham]

I'd love a taste. You're obviously working towards perfection. The numbers you posted just don't seem to do your bread justice. I can't touch, feel it, or taste it, and somehow, I cannot appreciate it by your descriptions, though it looks great. I'm happy that you are happy with it though. That is really what counts most.

[Jed]

Hi Richard,

I have also been working with a starter. My experience is very similar to yours. If I use a high percentage of the 'white' flour, the bread comes out lighter. But I want the benefit and the flavor of the other grains, so most of my breads are pretty heavy.

Peter Reinhart, in his new book, addresses this issue by adding a touch of yeast to the final mix on the dough. Mix the two main parts, and set overnight: and when you put the two parts together (the starter and the other flours that have been mixed and set over night to develop flavor) he will toss in a bit of instant yeast.

With these receipts the breads come out lighter... and with the benefits of different flavors and flours.

JED

[Dutchoven]

Originally Posted by Jed

Hi Richard,

I have also been working with a starter. My experience is very similar to yours. If I use a high percentage of the 'white' flour, the bread comes out lighter. But I want the benefit and the flavor of the other grains, so most of my breads are pretty heavy.

Peter Reinhart, in his new book, addresses this issue by adding a touch of yeast to the final mix on the dough. Mix the two main parts, and set overnight: and when you put the two parts together (the starter and the other flours that have been mixed and set over night to develop flavor) he will toss in a bit of instant yeast.

With these receipts the breads come out lighter... and with the benefits of different flavors and flours.

JED

Keep in mind that whole grain breads tend to be denser mostly due to the bran cutting the gluten strands...and not so much so due to the yeasts...if you are able to get a finer whole flour you will find a lighter loaf...also the flour can be sifted to remove some of the bran...
Best
Dutch

[MoonshineBaker]

Thanks for the feedback on the sourdough and adding yeast later.

Here's another experiment using sourdough....This last weekend I made what I call a sourdough ciabatta style bread. It turned out well in my opinion; it had a crunchy crust, bubbly soft crumb and good slightly sour full flavor. I did the preferment with the sourdough starter for 16 hours at 60*F using Giusto's Bakers Choice at 100% hydration. I used this as 1/3 of the final dough. The final dough was at 75% hydration. The flour for the rest of the dough was 90% KA all-purpose and 10% KA whole wheat flour. Giusto's yeast was @2% and added after proofing for 10 minutes. Salt was @2%, which was added after all other ingredients were mixed for 3 minutes at low speed in my Kitchen Aide mixer with a dough hook. The dough was mixed another 3 minutes at medium speed; the dough didn't pull away from the sides like I've seen with making regular ciabatta ala Hamelman. It sort of oozed, flowed into an oiled bowl where it rose for 2 hours at 65-70*F and more than doubled. I flowed it on to a well floured counter then divided it up. Each very loose bubbly section was put on an oiled and floured piece of parchment paper. Those were placed in a proofing box within a floured couche. They rose for another two hours almost doubling in size; were gingerly transferred to the oven on the parchment paper and baked for 20 minutes at about 500*F to 205*F internal temperature. There was some oven spring but not much. This is a really fluid dough and not easily handled!

Has anybody tried this? Again any feedback is appreciated.

Richard