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  #71  
Old 03-12-2014, 03:41 PM
ATK406's Avatar
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Default Re: A New Journey

Hello Loren,
Here is a link to a thread that discussed dome geometry in some detail, albeit it is probably more academic than anything else (i.e. they all work very well);
Mathematical analysis of dome geometry - Forno Bravo Forum: The Wood-Fired Oven Community (Mathematical analysis of dome geometry)

I have some leftover firebricks. Someday maybe I'll run an experiment and lay them out on the floor, raising my floor by 2.5 inches, and see if it makes any difference. To be honest I hope it doesn't, then I could just let it go...which is what I should do anyway.

As stated by so many before...build what it "right" for you. With the exception of those unfortunate souls who have built ovens without insulation, this website is nothing if not a testament to the many different ways that these ovens can be built and that there is very little you can do wrong. It is a "Journey" after all. And what a fine journey it is. You will be astounded with the results. I only suggest that you keep your eyes open and consider your alternatives along the way.

Good Luck,
Regards,
AT
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  #72  
Old 03-12-2014, 04:06 PM
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Default Re: A New Journey

It allows for a better heat balance for very rapid cooking, sub 90 seconds. Other than that it doesn't really matter that much.
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  #73  
Old 03-12-2014, 04:33 PM
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Default Re: A New Journey

Hardest part of build a low dome is that you can't use a standard IT. You either need to mount it off center on a lazy-susan like device, drop the pivot so that the IT starts below the floor, or have a way to crank the IT length back by a little bit for each layer of bricks. Or you can use a plywood form like I did. All of these will work, but they're bit more of a challenge to those of us who probably will only build one oven in their lives!

Agree with Stonecutter that Neo oven is great for pizza, but in reality you may never notice the difference when you have no point of comparison! I built my oven 18" high for a 39" diameter. So it's about 1.5" inches off a true dome. I bet I would have never noticed the difference if I had built a truly hemispheric dome.

As for the door, 63%ish on the height and go wild on the width! A wider door and shallower throat make it easier to access more of the oven with your peel. That is a change I might notice if I ever build another one of these.
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  #74  
Old 03-12-2014, 05:57 PM
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Default Re: A New Journey

Quote:
Originally Posted by UtahBeehiver View Post
Loren,

Too bad Karangi Dude is no longer with us.
What you mean? I must have missed something - he hasn't passed away has he?
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  #75  
Old 03-12-2014, 06:03 PM
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Default Re: A New Journey

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Originally Posted by wotavidone View Post
What you mean? I must have missed something - he hasn't passed away has he?
No, thank god, that he is fine . Just on a "temporary" sabbatical, I hope!
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  #76  
Old 03-12-2014, 08:36 PM
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Default Re: A New Journey

Doug pulled all of his threads off the forum a while back so we lost a great build and cooking resource. I got an email from him the other day and he still continues to teach WFO cooking classes. Like Gulf say, maybe he will come back some day.
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  #77  
Old 03-12-2014, 08:57 PM
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Default Re: A New Journey

Good thread. I may have missed something along the way, or gotten off subject, but...... I did for my first WFO, a build which had a 39 " diameter and a 15 inch dome height, not the typical ratio. (Totally inexperienced builder). Guess it was for the challenge which i wanted. I did the lazy susan type IT which wasn't any problem. I wasn't sure why I did this, except for something off the normal build. (I was green and probably still am). In the big picture I probably would not have noticed any energy efficiency difference regarding dome width to height ratio. The one big thing I did follow was the inner arch height/width ratio which I think is a major element in the overall WFO efficiency. Another thing which I did was to over insulate.....no such thing as too much insulation....top nor bottom.

jon

I am certainly looking forward to another WFO build next fall.
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  #78  
Old 03-14-2014, 10:13 AM
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Default Re: A New Journey

Thank you all for your tips and suggestions. I'll give it some thought. My IT is adjustable but I'll read over the math page and then make a final decision

On Wednesday I poured my Counter and filled almost all the rest of my cores needed to fill. I only have a remainder of about 6 cores left which should be about 4 bags of Concrete. On Wednesday I used 39, 80 LB bags of cement mix to fill the remainder of the cores and pour the counter. By the time I end with these last cores I will have used about 55, 80 LB bags of cement in addition to the 4 yards I used to pour the Pads for the Oven/grill island

We also moved the grill island out on to its pad. I will have to make a small adjustment to one of the bottom supports so that my electrical will fit through the bottom to move it in to its final resting spot.

Today I am going to remove the forms and pour the final cores. I will also take my template out on to the newly poured counter and get all my insulation bricks and Firebricks layed out for the floor of the oven.
Attached Thumbnails
A New Journey-arch-w-angle-iron.jpg   A New Journey-floor-form-w-rebar.jpg   A New Journey-wfo-counter-pour2.jpg   A New Journey-wfo-counter-pour.jpg  
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Last edited by the_dr_masuess; 03-14-2014 at 10:17 AM.
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  #79  
Old 03-19-2014, 10:44 AM
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Default Re: A New Journey

Hello Loren,
I've been following your build for a while, looking good. I see your in the planning stages of your heat break. I too really followed and model a lot of my build from Russell's. My heat break is similar, I think he used rectangular tubing and his middle arch, sat in front of his inner arch. I found his pictures worth a thousand words. I have included a couple of quotes from my build that may help you if your interested. Just click on the blue arrows which will take you to the post with some picture of my heat break. Russell has a link to all his picture in his signature. I found it very useful to be able to quickly scroll thru all his pictures Gulf's and others, for quick reference. I need to do the same for all my pictures.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbartman View Post

I managed to finish my vent floor and heat break.

My floor heat break is blend of the those whom trodden before. I'm not sure how well it will perform, but it's better then nothing. I should had used a wider piece of stainless. it would have allowed a thicker section of insulating brick beneath. I ended up with only a one inch sliver of insulating brick. I thought about beveling the two types of brick but didn't thing I would gain much. Most of all the angle cuts would have been a nightmare of difficulty. So it is what it is. I can always put a wider insulating and stainless barrier later if I don't like how it performs.

I incorporated a ceramic fiber band like Gulf did, this should slow some of the heat transfer to the stainless and beyond. We will see......... I allowed the stainless tubing to be slightly higher than the surrounding bricks. This should keep the edges of the bricks from chipping. The square tubing has a nicely rounded corners the and any tool or pans etc... should glide over it easily I hope.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbartman View Post
Still slow going here.

I manage to finish the chimney penetration, finish my heat breaks and put some masonry fire clay home brew cladding on the dome. I used Koawool caulking to seal my heat breaks. The neutral white turn bright white after drying.......ouch. I wish I would have placed the fiber rope deeper into the recess and hid the caulking joint.....Oh well...........the joint is very firm and I agree with DJ and think it will hold up well..... I would have like to have used the safe stuff Utah used, but it was just too pricey at $43.85 each........Now that I think about it 23, bucks difference is nothing............
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  #80  
Old 03-19-2014, 12:24 PM
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Default Re: A New Journey

Hey Bart,

Yes I have been debating what to do there and both of your ideas are spot on what I think I will do. Maybe Russell will be nice enough to stop by my house when he is visiting family by where I live . We live about 30 min from each other. I think right now I need to prioritize finishing up the floor (I need a couple more firebricks), Deciding how wide to make my inner arch, And buying my 3:1:1:1 mixes. Once I have those items nailed up I can really start building the dome. I also have quite a bit more cutting of my blocks. If you remember in my thread I have huge monster bricks so I am working on cutting them down. Thanks for adding your exact thread messages here so I can always reference them.

I moved my grill island in to place and also need to get the stucco on that. For now I just have a tarp covering it.

on a side note my wife wants me to follow this design of the fireplace at the citycreek mall for the oven so imagine a square flue running up with rock and this design on a smaller scale for the rest of the structure...

I'm getting ahead of myself here...
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