#11  
Old 08-16-2014, 10:21 PM
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Default Re: Any flaws in my dome and arch design?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GianniFocaccia View Post
Zoltan,

As many times as I looked at your excellent oven drawings, I am still perplexed. Your profile view looks spot while in the plan view the oven arch (ala Russell) appears to be too close to oven center. (see pic #1 of my completed arch).
I wonder if the arch looks too close to oven center primarily because my oven is 36" compared to many others which are 42". Also, the appearance of a thin 4.5" deep arch might contribute.

In the first attached image (plan view), I drew what I expect the first course of the dome arch would be in my oven. A significant portion is cut because of the curve of the dome....(hard to explain, please see pic). Basically, the brick would be only 2.7" deep here. Is this the problem that you and Russell allude to? Is this too thin?? At the top dead center, it would be just shy of 4.5". If I make the dome arch bricks 6.5" instead, then the thinnest part would be 4.7", similar to the rest of the dome.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GianniFocaccia View Post
Zoltan,

If you construct your vent attached to your oven you will lose a good portion of your heatbreak design. With my entryway completely separate from the oven, I am finding 3-4 days of usable heat following a pizza session. My record is 425F on the third day.
Wow! 3-4 days of usable heat....the lower mass of my 36" might not have that potential, but it's something to aim for.

Nonetheless, I agree and was aware of the downside of a firebrick transition connecting the dome and vent arch. I have redrawn my plans to include a double arch vent which now is completely separate from the dome. In order to do this, I increased the vent landing depth by 2.5". In order to minimize the change in view into the oven, I increased the opening ( and therefore the reveal to 1.5").

Option A is the original plan and Option B is the new....I am leaning towards B given my newfound knowledge.

Would 2" for the back arch be enough? I think I have seen arches that had similar dimensions.
Attached Thumbnails
Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-arch1.jpg   Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-3d12.jpg   Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-3d6.jpg   Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-3d9.jpg  

Last edited by stlouisz; 08-16-2014 at 10:27 PM.
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  #12  
Old 08-16-2014, 10:24 PM
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Default Re: Any flaws in my dome and arch design?

Here are the CAD drawings of the 2 options... I tried to put the options side by side to aid in comparison...My brain now hurts....I need to go to bed.
Attached Thumbnails
Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-option-1.jpg   Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-option-2.jpg   Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-option-3.jpg   Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-option-4.jpg  

Last edited by stlouisz; 08-16-2014 at 10:28 PM.
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  #13  
Old 08-17-2014, 09:30 AM
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Default Re: Any flaws in my dome and arch design?

Now I understand why my dome arch needs to be made from bricks longer than 4.5".

I moved the arch 1/4" further from the dome center and made them 1.5" longer.

I redrew the plan view and cross section for Option B. The plan view shows the first course of bricks, which makes it a cleaner drawing.

Since the depth of the vent and dome arch have increased since my first drawings, is the 10" depth of the counter still ok?

I was planning to cut a half brick while on it's edge (standing 4.5" upright) and fit it under a 10" Harbor Freight saw. Will it fit? Specs say it will only cut 3.5" deep, so I would have to flip the brick to cut through it.
Attached Thumbnails
Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-plan-view-2.jpg   Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-cross-section-3.jpg  

Last edited by stlouisz; 08-17-2014 at 09:51 AM.
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  #14  
Old 08-17-2014, 01:15 PM
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Default Re: Any flaws in my dome and arch design?

Quote:
I wonder if the arch looks too close to oven center primarily because my oven is 36" compared to many others which are 42". Also, the appearance of a thin 4.5" deep arch might contribute.
I totally agree, as I didn't factor that in. (My oven is 39"). The other factor is how you build your arch. Some builders build a linear arch prior to constructing the dome. If you go course-by-course and sequentially cut your lower-tiered arch bricks in a circular fashion to match your TDC brick, your arch should end up circular in fashion in plan view.

Quote:
In the first attached image (plan view), I drew what I expect the first course of the dome arch would be in my oven. A significant portion is cut because of the curve of the dome....(hard to explain, please see pic)
Agreed. (I think) See answer above.

Quote:
Wow! 3-4 days of usable heat....the lower mass of my 36" might not have that potential, but it's something to aim for
I attribute my heat retention to insulation (5.5" under the floor and 4-7" around the dome). Keep in mind the 425F was achieved not opening the door once until the third day. If I cook something on the second day (lasagna, roast chicken, etc) the third day (225-250F) is usually only good for pulled pork or other slow-cooked braises, etc. Your oven should perform similarly.

Quote:
In order to do this, I increased the vent landing depth by 2.5". In order to minimize the change in view into the oven, I increased the opening ( and therefore the reveal to 1.5").
You can achieve a huge benefit (IMHO) by simply flaring your entryway. With your understanding of the metrics involved in a build, I'm sure doing this would be a no-brainer for you. My reveal (1.25") is more than adequate to accommodate my door easily.

Quote:
Would 2" for the back arch be enough? I think I have seen arches that had similar dimensions.
It should be ok, if your all-firebrick vent is integrated into your hemispherical entryway vault. I would be not so confident if it was a flatter arch with vertical entryway walls. I was tentative that my inner-entryway arch was only 3.5", but found that that my vent design helped solidify the entire structure. If I had it to do over again, I would have followed Colin's (oasisdm) rebated design, which allows for a 6" inner arch depth.

Nice job with your research and approach to your build. You should end up with a top-notch oven.

John
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  #15  
Old 08-17-2014, 01:49 PM
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Default Re: Any flaws in my dome and arch design?

Sorry, I just caught your last two posts, so here are my thoughts:

Quote:
I moved the arch 1/4" further from the dome center and made them 1.5" longer
I used my wood template to tell me where to put my oven arch. I cut a second template vertically where the bottom of the arch would end up. See pics. I am wondering if this approach is viable with a 36" oven. I can only assume that if the door ratios are consistent with both sizes, it would work.

After looking at your revised designs, the amount of arch brick you have extending forward from the dome is not really needed. Why couldn't you swap 2" from the oven arch and 'give it' to the inner entryway arch?

Quote:
Since the depth of the vent and dome arch have increased since my first drawings, is the 10" depth of the counter still ok?
This is totally up to you. Some ovens don't have any counter space in front of their oven.

Quote:
I was planning to cut a half brick while on it's edge (standing 4.5" upright) and fit it under a 10" Harbor Freight saw. Will it fit? Specs say it will only cut 3.5" deep, so I would have to flip the brick to cut through it
Yes, you will have to flip your bricks over to complete cutting them. I started my build with a HF 10" saw, and finished with an MK101 contractor saw. With both saws, since virtually every one of my bricks was custom-cut, it was easier to rotate the brick against the stationary blade while holding it (firmly) in my hand. This also allowed me drag the face of each brick at an angle across the blade to end up with a concave curvature.

John
Attached Thumbnails
Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-dome-template-angles.jpg   Any flaws in my dome and arch design?-oven-arch-angles.jpg  
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