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  #21  
Old 01-08-2014, 04:32 AM
Il Pizzaiolo
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,008
Default Re: SE QLD oven

I don't think it would be enough thermal mase in the hearth if you want to cook for days afterfiring. Insulation sounds fine but the floor thickness at 35 mm would possibly be problem. IF you have purchased the kit with the 35mm tiles I would obtain some more and do 2 layers of tiles.

You could cut the first layer under the dome brick and have the second layer inside the dome. I layed mine [75mm tiles] inside the dome.

So far having fired mine since the 15/12 some quite large fires since new year, I have not noticed any cracking [Yet]. I feel if the dome is layed on the hearth bricks the dome is more susceptible to floor expansion if the floor expands the dome bricks must move [therefore cracks], even if the first course is not fastened to the Hearth bricks [although this must help in preventing it cracking] but this is just my opinion on the subject. Others will have a different view.
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  #22  
Old 01-08-2014, 02:18 PM
Serf
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 18
Default Re: SE QLD oven

Thanks Colin.
Just a question, could you keep the 30mm floor tile and double up on the ceramic board thickness? Would that give you more thermal mass?
Regards
Ashley.
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  #23  
Old 01-08-2014, 02:20 PM
Serf
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 18
Default Re: SE QLD oven

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenman View Post
Pre-cut kits and the like are good. Probably takes the learning/adventure out of it and makes it a bit like Lego I expect. They will all work at some level or another and it depends how deep your pockets are because some of the kits are not cheap by comparison.

I found half of the satisfaction from sourcing the materials and keeping the costs reasonable (which I managed to do). No need to sacrifice the quality of the build either.

If you are time poor a kit would look good I suppose.
Thanks Steve.
Anyone with some or knows of some bricks for sale locally, let me know please.

Ashley
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  #24  
Old 01-08-2014, 03:07 PM
Il Pizzaiolo
 
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Location: Australia
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Default Re: SE QLD oven

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ash71 View Post
Thanks Colin.
Just a question, could you keep the 30mm floor tile and double up on the ceramic board thickness? Would that give you more thermal mass?
Regards
Ashley.
No..

Ceramic board is insulation therefore not thermal mass. I'm no scientist or expert but thermal mass provides I believe a dense structure that can absorb the heat and retain it. Ceramic board simply stops the heat escaping. Not withstanding that, more insulation is of course better.

If I was to do mine WFO again [which I will be in a new place] I might consider adding a second layer of ceramic board. but as it is I have 5" of effective insulation below my 75mm oven floor tiles.

Consider adding another layer of fire brick tiles at 35 or 50mm.
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  #25  
Old 01-08-2014, 08:04 PM
mnl mnl is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 69
Default Re: SE QLD oven

Hi Ash

I have used a fire brick tile for the floor which was only 40mm thick. In order to keep costs down but get the thermal mass I has put a layer of ordinary clay pavers below this which are 40mm thick. I found a place that sells seconds that were $2 a pop and only needed to 12 of them. Not sure if this was a good idea or not as still in the drying/curing process but others on the forum may be able to comment.

Mark
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  #26  
Old 01-08-2014, 09:48 PM
Il Pizzaiolo
 
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Location: Australia
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Default Re: SE QLD oven

Interesting idea Mark.

Can't see why that wouldn't work.

I was so keen on doing it right I had 20 x 75mm firebrick tiles shipped from Sydney at I think around $18.70 each plus $100 [only because I knew someone in freight forwarding].

Yeah could have used 2 layers of 50mm or 40mm [never did price this option [Damn] and that would have given me even more thermal mass at the expense of heat up time.

The 75mm probably also less chance of cracking.
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  #27  
Old 01-09-2014, 01:41 AM
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Location: brisbane australia
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Default Re: SE QLD oven

Gudday
Most forno ovens are 1/2 brick dome 115mm with a 50 mm firebrick tile floor or firebrick set on 75 mm face. Seems to give a good balance all round oven that heats up in a reasonable time and retains heat over a reasonable time.
The floor is thinner than the dome mainly because its longer to heat up. Heat rises and the dome gets more heat than the floor. The tip of the flame is hotter than the base of the flame same as the old Bunsen burner at school. The floor also is insulated from heat radiating from the dome to certain extent by the coals and ash.
From what I read a 50mm dome takes 60 to 90 mins to saturation, a 115 mm more like 120 to 150. Increasing the mass means more time till saturation and that's what is important to me regardless of the wood consumption.
With a thinner dome shell gives you faster time till saturation ( pizza time) but less baking time . A larger than forno mass oven gives you a longer wait till saturation but an extended baking time. I have little interest in multiple bakes I can only give away so much bread. If I need more baking temp I flash up another fire, a hot oven is faster to heat than a cold one.
That's why I think the forno formula for oven mass is the best for an all round oven reasonable heat up times and reasonable baking times.
Anyway that's my take on that.
Regards dave
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  #28  
Old 01-09-2014, 02:49 AM
Serf
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Australia
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Default Re: SE QLD oven

Thanks for all the info. Should I be trying to keep the vermiculite layer dry now that I've poured it?
Ashley.
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  #29  
Old 01-09-2014, 03:00 AM
Apprentice
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Brisbane Australia
Posts: 127
Default Re: SE QLD oven

I would cover it for the initial cure. Perhaps a week to allow the insulation to strengthen. It takes concrete about 28 days to reach about 80 percent strength. But maybe it doesn't matter that much as vermicucrete does hold water, and thus cure reasonably.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ash71 View Post
Thanks for all the info. Should I be trying to keep the vermiculite layer dry now that I've poured it?
Ashley.

Yes, I think the general idea is to try and dry out the base as much as you can before building more layers on top. Let the sun shine on it. The more water you evaporate now the quicker the oven will dry out in the future.

It can take considerable time to drive all the water out of an oven when its completed. Water may stay in the insulating layers even though it looks dry.

Cheers,

Steve.

Last edited by brissie; 01-09-2014 at 03:10 AM.
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  #30  
Old 01-09-2014, 03:09 PM
Serf
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 18
Default Re: SE QLD oven

Some pics of the vermiculite. Have to pour some concrete around the outside yet.
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SE QLD oven-023.jpg   SE QLD oven-026.jpg  
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