#11  
Old 06-27-2011, 05:59 PM
Journeyman
 
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Default Re: Calcium Aluminate - Ciment Fondu

Quote:
Originally Posted by david s View Post
I know cement mixers often carry a kilo of sugar in their trucks in case they get stuck and the load goes off. Apparently it is sufficient to stop the stuff going off at all. Johnny, how much sugar do you need to use and will it effect the end product ?
LOL, they use the sugar for their coffee when they are stuck at a job.
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  #12  
Old 06-28-2011, 04:06 AM
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Default Re: Calcium Aluminate - Ciment Fondu

There is no mention of using lime which makes sense given the experience of others that have written on other forum threads about making home brew calcium aluminate mortars. So even though the pompeii plans indicate to use lime in the home brew calcium aluminate mortar, I think all the evidence says it is not required and I don't intent to use lime in mine.

Thanks
Brett[/QUOTE]

I used Ciment Fondu (7.2 lt) mixed with Blue metal crusher dust (25 lt) water (3.9 lt)and mixed in 2 percent melt extract fiber from ANTEC. No lime. The dome was cast over a sand mold and is 100 mm thick. I have fired up the oven about 10 times and so far there are no sign of any cracks or spalling of the surface.
John.
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  #13  
Old 06-28-2011, 01:17 PM
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Default Re: Calcium Aluminate - Ciment Fondu

Hope it works ok, cracker dust is not a suitable aggregate for high temp. application. This brew is often used for the lining of chimneys. Maybe it will be adequate for WFO temps. Time will tell.
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  #14  
Old 06-28-2011, 03:04 PM
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Default Re: Calcium Aluminate - Ciment Fondu

The Ciment Fondu web site rates basalt and granite to 800 deg C. My actual dome temp has never been over 600 C yet so heres hoping!
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  #15  
Old 07-02-2011, 04:02 PM
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Default Re: Calcium Aluminate - Ciment Fondu

Found the attached article which talks about accelerators and retarders - a bit techno but some of you might like it. P9 Figure 7 lists Lithium Carbonate and Lime as accelerators and citric acid and sodium citrate as retarders.
It also shows how temperature affects setting.

Made my first small batches of CAC homebrew with grog (crushed firebrick) instead of sand and fireclay. The first small batch I didn't use fireclay and found I really needed to wet the grog and let it absorb some moisture before mixing.
The next few mixes I wet the grog and fireclay before adding CAC and water which worked a lot better.

Set time was over 2 hours at < 20 celcius which is pretty much what the datasheet says. I will try a batch for interest with quarter the lime of FB recipe as others have used.

Brett
Attached Files
File Type: pdf TP_GB_RE_LAF_043.pdf (505.1 KB, 1490 views)
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  #16  
Old 07-02-2011, 07:13 PM
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Default Re: Calcium Aluminate - Ciment Fondu

Great find! Interesting reading. My Daniel Rhodes book says 5 parts crushed firebrick to 1part CA cement by volume for a castable mix, but does not give proportions for a mortar. There are all kinds of grogs, make sure that it is crushed fire brick, as the paper says fillers will have a reactive effect on the CA and can alter setting and hardening times. I have always used temp of water to help slow down the reaction as this does not interfere with the chemistry. The paper also confirms this. Keep testing and let's hear your results.
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  #17  
Old 07-14-2011, 09:38 PM
Peasant
 
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Default Re: Calcium Aluminate - Ciment Fondu

Hi Everyone,
I was recently told that refractory mortar is recommended for joints up to 3.5mm thick, because if laid any thicker that this it was prone to cracking.

On the other hand, I was told that the composition of Cement fondue was much more flexible and could be used for joints up to 50mm thick without crackimg.

Does anyone have any experience with using cement fondue purely a s a mortar with firebricks.

Does the advice I have been given match with your experience.

Fornoa
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  #18  
Old 07-14-2011, 10:01 PM
Journeyman
 
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Default Re: Calcium Aluminate - Ciment Fondu

It becomes an expensive mortar. Have you considered Field Furnace refractories for supply of a mortar mix? They are in Wetherill Park NSW
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  #19  
Old 07-15-2011, 02:47 AM
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Default Re: Calcium Aluminate - Ciment Fondu

brighton cement has calcium auminate cement that you mix with cement sand at ratio of 1 to 2 but you must add water at no more than 40% cement volume
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  #20  
Old 07-15-2011, 03:02 AM
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Default Re: Calcium Aluminate - Ciment Fondu

adelaide brighton cement has a calcium aluminate cement (istra 40) you mix it with cement sand at a ratio of 1 to 2 but do not use any more than 40 % of water to the volume of cement
so 20l sand
10l cement
4l water max
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