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  #11  
Old 03-18-2010, 05:25 PM
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Default Re: Fire clay Mortar Vs Refractor Mortar FB.... HeatStop... Earthcore

Quote:
Originally Posted by berryst View Post
I used lime, clay, sand, and portland cement. My major concern was spalling. To date, after a couple of years use no spalling has occured.
I would use it again.
berryst
Is that just ordinary clay that you used for the homebrew? If so, I may have to do it your way just in case I can't find fireclay.
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  #12  
Old 03-18-2010, 06:44 PM
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Default Re: Fire clay Mortar Vs Refractor Mortar FB.... HeatStop... Earthcore

I understand cost is the big driver for this choice. What are we looking at for the difference? I know material costs very by region but some examples of how much mortar we would be looking,, at what it cost people would be helpful thanks
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  #13  
Old 03-18-2010, 10:57 PM
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Default Re: Fire clay Mortar Vs Refractor Mortar FB.... HeatStop... Earthcore

As to the cost question, the homebrew is much more cost efficient. The refractory mortar usually runs about $55.00 per 50# bag and most people have said that they use 4-5 bags. For the cost of 1 bag of HeatStop 50 you can make all the homebrew you need to assemble your dome. I am using the homebrew recipe and find it easy to work with. I went with the homebrew because many people had used it on this site without problems.

Raffy, I have heard fireclay referred to as mortarclay ( actually I have a bag of mortar clay) I think what you may have is straight fireclay.
Eric
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  #14  
Old 03-19-2010, 03:46 AM
Il Pizzaiolo
 
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Default Re: Fire clay Mortar Vs Refractor Mortar FB.... HeatStop... Earthcore

Hi Raffy,,
Is it possible to call the company to get an MSDS ? Material Safety Data Sheet That will give you a list of all the ingredients in the product and any dangers and such... Then you may know how to proceed with it....
Cheers
Mark
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  #15  
Old 03-19-2010, 04:28 AM
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Default Re: Fire clay Mortar Vs Refractor Mortar FB.... HeatStop... Earthcore

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Originally Posted by ThisOldGarageNJ View Post
Hi Raffy,,
Is it possible to call the company to get an MSDS ? Material Safety Data Sheet That will give you a list of all the ingredients in the product and any dangers and such... Then you may know how to proceed with it....
Cheers
Mark
Good idea. I'll call them first thing on Monday then I'll post the ingredients and maybe you can tell me if this is just ordinary fireclay or if it has some other additives that will cause it to set. Thanks, Mark.

Oh, and by the way, would love to have your comments on my latest progress which I posted on my WFO build thread. I'd really appreciate your insight.

Warm Regards,
Raffy
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  #16  
Old 03-19-2010, 04:50 AM
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Default Re: Fire clay Mortar Vs Refractor Mortar FB.... HeatStop... Earthcore

Commercial mortars tend to be designed for much higher service temps (like 1300 C) This is way in excess of what we require. Sand in the mortar can turn to glass in the presence of certain fluxes. This does not occur at the lower temps we use. Lime mortars were used for hundreds of years with great success, but they are not as strong as portland cement mortars, although they do stand up to heat really well. I think the high temp mortars are a waste of money. Just my opinion.
Dave
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  #17  
Old 03-19-2010, 05:07 AM
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Default Re: Fire clay Mortar Vs Refractor Mortar FB.... HeatStop... Earthcore

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Originally Posted by eprante View Post
Raffy, I have heard fireclay referred to as mortarclay ( actually I have a bag of mortar clay) I think what you may have is straight fireclay.
Eric
Hi Eric,

I'm thinking that too. It would not have fazed me if it were not for the suppliers comment. They said not to mix it with any other substance and adding water would suffice.

This stuff looks like the SK32 Firebricks I bought but in powder form. I'm thinking it sets/bonds the bricks together as it bakes in the heat. Could be an airset type mortar? It hardens if you bake it in the sun but crumbles if you scratch it.

I tried it with the homebrew recipe changing the ratio of sand to 2 since the fireclay appeared to have sand in it already. So it goes 1:1:1:2 lime, portland, the "SK32 Mortar", sand. It hardened after 3 hours and seems to be setting properly. It appears strong but I'll test the bond strength tomorrow once its been given some time to cure.

I'll post the ingredients once I get it from the supplier.

Thanks for your help

Raffy
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Last edited by Raffy; 03-19-2010 at 07:28 AM.
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  #18  
Old 03-19-2010, 08:20 AM
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Default Re: Fire clay Mortar Vs Refractor Mortar FB.... HeatStop... Earthcore

Products Details
Look here

PRODUCT TYPE STA.SK.32 STA.SK.34 STA.SK.34 STA.SK.38
Suhu Kerja Maximum
Dalam (0C) 1.200 1.400 1.600 1.700
Komposisi Kimia
A12 O3 (%)
Si O2 (%)
Fe2 O3 (%)
35
57
2,3
45
50
1,8
57
32
1,2
70
19
0,7
Ukuran Butir (%)
+ 0,5 mm
- 0,74 mm
<2
<35
<2
<37
<2
<40
<2
<40
Pemakaian Fire Clay Brick High Alumina Brick
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  #19  
Old 03-19-2010, 10:33 AM
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Default Re: Fire clay Mortar Vs Refractor Mortar FB.... HeatStop... Earthcore

Hey Chris,

Thanks for that link! It gave me other links which showed me that SK32 Mortar is actually heat setting. All I can glean from this is that it will set only through heat. I need advice from you experts whether it would be bad for me to use this SK32 Mortar in place of fireclay for the homebrew. I searched the forno bravo forum for heat set and was surprised to see that Frances has a similar heat set mortar I am using. I am currently reading her thread trying to learn from her experience. Added insight from you guys much appreciated!

http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f6/h...ying-2584.html (Heat resistant mortar - hydraulic or ceramic drying??)

http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f8/h...clay-2783.html (Heat-dry mortar made of refactory clay and refactory sand (and nothing else))
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  #20  
Old 03-19-2010, 10:35 AM
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Default Re: Fire clay Mortar Vs Refractor Mortar FB.... HeatStop... Earthcore

Quote:
Originally Posted by eprante View Post
As to the cost question, the homebrew is much more cost efficient. The refractory mortar usually runs about $55.00 per 50# bag and most people have said that they use 4-5 bags. For the cost of 1 bag of HeatStop 50 you can make all the homebrew you need to assemble your dome. ....
Perfect looks like I will be going the homebrew route as well

Thanks
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