Starter and bread formulas/methods

[DrakeRemoray]

Hey Ed, On the quest for sourness...

This is from a previous discussion on starters...
I think there is a difference in letting a sourdough bread retard longer should increase the sour flavor. The drier environment during the retardation is favored by a different type of bacteria than the wet environment of the starter. I believe, that a longer, drier, fermentation will result in a more sour flavor, while a longer wet environment will result in more sugars that help with crust development. I may be out of my league now, but I think that is the difference between Acetic (sour and dry loving) vs Lactic (sweeter and wet loving) acids...

Hope that helps.
Drake

[Dutchoven]

Originally Posted by DrakeRemoray

Hey Ed, On the quest for sourness...

This is from a previous discussion on starters...
I think there is a difference in letting a sourdough bread retard longer should increase the sour flavor. The drier environment during the retardation is favored by a different type of bacteria than the wet environment of the starter. I believe, that a longer, drier, fermentation will result in a more sour flavor, while a longer wet environment will result in more sugars that help with crust development. I may be out of my league now, but I think that is the difference between Acetic (sour and dry loving) vs Lactic (sweeter and wet loving) acids...

Hope that helps.
Drake

Excellent posting Drake and very true.
Ed,
On the brick front you should check with your brickyard guys, when we built our oven I was able to use firebricks that were supposed to be returned to the vendor. I was looking around the brickyard and saw them and the next day I asked about them. We were able to buy the majority of ours at $0.35 per...we had to hand pick them and load them...we bought new ones for the hearth floor so they would be smoother for about $1.10 each
Maybe you can find a deal like that?!
Best
Dutch

[Ed_]

Drake-- Excellent tip! I'll try a batch or two with an overnight retardation and see what kind of effect it has.

Dutch-- I'll be sure to ask about any "reject" firebrick. The whole thing is a little awkward because there's no brickyard in Ames; I have to go 40 miles to Des Moines. With the delivery fee involved, I have to do an annoying amount of planning ahead.

[Frances]

The really good thing about this discussion (for me ) is that I'm far less worried about my bread turning out too sour. After all, If you're trying to get it sour and can't, that means I can safely experiment as much as I like...

[Ed_]

Glad to be of assistance, Frances!

[Tim F]

My favourite results have been when I mix the starter with the dough and leave it for 24 hours, with a couple of kneads in between to make sure the bacteria and yeast is distributed evenly. Then I shape the dough, rise again for as long as it needs, and bake. But as far as I'm concerned there's no such thing as too sour!

[krosskraft]

I made Ed's sour dough starter a few weeks ago and have been experimenting. I personally like my sour dough with not much sourness....ha ha. Today I did everything with Ed's instructions except added some malted barley for a little sweetness and 1/4 tsp yeast. I will let you know how that turns out. The reason I am doing that is that I don't have time to let it full rise and then refrigerate.....gotta get this in the oven some time tonight.

[Dutchoven]

Important thing to remember also is that different bacterias and wild yeasts are present in different places and not all of them make "sour" bread
Best
Dutch