#11  
Old 04-06-2010, 04:18 PM
Journeyman
 
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Location: minnesota, usa
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Default Re: Ciabatta

Are you doing these as sourdough or conventional yeast? I think I have posted this before...LOVE, LOVE this recipe for ciabatta:
Jason's Quick Coccodrillo Ciabatta Bread | The Fresh Loaf
It's 95% hydration but it requires almost zero handling so no problem. I think it's better and easier than the Renhardt recipe.
I tried it once as sourdough and failed, but I think I need to give it another go. OTOH, it's one of the few breads where I'm willing to stoop to conventional yeast because it's so fantastic and so easy.
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  #12  
Old 04-06-2010, 08:09 PM
Il Pizzaiolo
 
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Location: San Antonio
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Default Re: Ciabatta

Hi Splatgirl!

I have done Jason's a few times. Very good, but I like more traditional folding approach/look so I don't do it often.

I suspect the problem with sourdough is the low activity and prolonged rise time which will result in having a hard time tripling and then having the flour absorb moisture and get gummy.

Try again! (consider using lower expansion ratios and higher proofing temp)
Jay
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  #13  
Old 04-07-2010, 10:35 PM
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Default Re: Ciabatta

Rossco, those ciabattas look wonderful . Do you do the final proofing on wax paper or white parchment? Then just slide them on to the oven stone? That's how I do it so I'm just curious.

Jay: since ciabatta has such a high hydration (or can have) how do you get those onto your oven stone?

That Jasons quick CCB recipe sounds good, I'll have to try it for comparison.
-Dino
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  #14  
Old 04-08-2010, 07:36 AM
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Default Re: Ciabatta

Hi Dino ... sorry about the delay in responding but things have been really hectic with my student activities - thesis marked and being tidied up for final submission in 3 weeks time.

About ciabatta, firstly, thanks for those kind comments. I must admit that I have battled a bit in the past with shaping and handling as the super wet dough has a strong tendency to go "flat". Quite understandably so given such a high hydration.

Last weekend I took the plunge and bough a baguette tray which makes the best ciabatta baguettes. These are perfect for serving to guests as they are the right thickness for both dipping in oil etc and also eating by the slice.

Previously I used baking paper and "built" the ciabattas on baking sheet, laid on a baking tray. Not as successful because during the rise loaves tend to flatten. Making some more this weekend for sure when I crank up my soup pot as it is starting to cool down.
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Last edited by heliman; 04-08-2010 at 05:10 PM.
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Old 04-08-2010, 03:39 PM
Il Pizzaiolo
 
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Default Re: Ciabatta

Hi Dino!

I have done them conventionally (just flour) and VERY DELICATE HANDLING and with parchment. Parchment is a lot easier. You sort of form your puddle of dough (dough development and folding are critical to get any level of substance to the puddle!) (That is why making 100% focaccia was educational for it maintained some structure even at that level!)

Jason's recipe is really good. A key to it is the LONG mixing which does finally get the dough to a reasonable condition. Most wet doughs are not fully developed and that contributes to the handling problems. I guarantee you will learn something from making Jason's.

Good Luck!
Jay
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  #16  
Old 04-08-2010, 03:41 PM
Il Pizzaiolo
 
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Default Re: Ciabatta

Hi Rossco!

Good luck with the thesis. I got word my rewrite was approved about two months ago (the defense was a year ago). I know what it can be like!

Dr. Jay
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  #17  
Old 04-08-2010, 05:17 PM
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Default Re: Ciabatta

Hi Jay ..

Congrats on finishing your thesis!

Quite a bit of fiddling involved when doing a thesis - largely because no one seems to know (or won't tell) what is actually involved. Bit of a secret society it would seem, but, it was all free so one can't complain.

Will be doing the Jason recipe tomorrow - it sounds really great. Thanks Splat for providing the link...
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  #18  
Old 04-08-2010, 06:52 PM
Il Pizzaiolo
 
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Default Re: Ciabatta

Having been through the process, Rosso, I agree with your assessment - yet that is ultimately how it must be!

Don't glue yourself to the table with the ciabatta!
Jay
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  #19  
Old 04-08-2010, 08:06 PM
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Default Re: Ciabatta

Perhaps the reason that the "apprenticeship" is characterised by pain and suffering is because this may well add to the "mysique" and "standing" of the degree in society. The notion of jumping through hoops is not unique to the PhD and I'm sure that it happens in other areas too. Not being a true academic myself, and having a peek inside the hallowed halls of this establishment has certainly raised a few more questions in my mind. In reality, just another thing to tick off as having been done I guess. But, that philosophical topic is for discussion at another time - this forum is for REAL issues like bread and pizza making...

Can't wait to have a go at the Jason bread - may have to dust of my recently retired KA for the occasion too. I did see that the recipe had a 4 hour turnaround - I believe Reinhart is slightly less than that (not sure though). One great tip I learned on reading the J recipe was that turning the dough over during proofing spreads the sought-after bubbles. Very useful to know....
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  #20  
Old 04-09-2010, 03:55 AM
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Default Re: Ciabatta

OK test under way. It's busy trippling so I thought I would add some commentary on my observations. The KA didn't appreciate the exercise! The burning coil smell got quite strong and I had to stop after about 20 mins. I did question if this was not overkneaded as cautioned by many artisan bakers including Reinhart. There was a fair bit of sticky dough in the gears too which took a bit of cleaning to remove.

Seems like a bit of effort to me - particularly as I have to stand over the mixer all the time it is slapping away. The recipe also doesn't include any olive oil which I really like about Reinhart's brew. Anyway, keeping an open mind at this stage - maybe the end result will make all the hassle pale into insignificance... I do hope so...
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