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  #31  
Old 11-21-2011, 07:59 AM
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Default Re: Leoparding - The Discussion Continues...

Yes, DM is definitely more flame than coals. Considering that they're selling 1000 pizzas a day, I don't see how they'd have much time to replenish the hearth heat by spreading coals on it, and, instead, depend on the roaring flame reflecting off the ceiling to keep the hearth hot.

I think you've got a typo in your ratios. Regardless, your current recipe, minus the biga, is well within Neapolitan specifications. It's going to take some trial and error to dial in the cake yeast quantity for an 18 hour ferment. I would start off fairly conservatively- it's better to have the dough not quite double in your allotted time frame and ramp the temp a bit to help it catch up, than to have it double early on you and force an earlier bake.
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  #32  
Old 11-22-2011, 03:17 PM
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Default Re: Leoparding - The Discussion Continues...

I noticed the DM wood was quite thinly cut. The wood I use now tends to be short and chunky - making good coals but not much in the way of flame. I have been adding smaller bits of wood to the coal bed to create a balanced fire but have some Bottlebrush wood which I will split to the size of the DM wood and use that to make a fire and see what the results look like.

I popped to the Italian store after work yesterday to get some fresh yeast but they had sold out. I will go out at lunch time today to try and get some. Will then make a batch of dough as per your suggestion.
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  #33  
Old 11-22-2011, 04:36 PM
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Default Re: Leoparding - The Discussion Continues...

It sounds like you're on the right track, Rossco, I'm looking forward to hearing about your next bake.

Speaking of thinner wood creating a more active flame, I distinctly recall seeing someone famous, maybe Mangieri, working with sawdust. I have no idea how to work that into the bake, but I think you'll do just fine with thinner pieces of wood.

Is the wood nice and dry?
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  #34  
Old 11-22-2011, 04:50 PM
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Default Re: Leoparding - The Discussion Continues...

I have heard of wood shavings being added for flavour (Mangieri and DM I think), but not sawdust as such.

Wood has been split and is drying in the hot sun at the moment. Should be good to go in a week or two's time. I have other super-dry wood which I will split thinner to use in the meantime.
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  #35  
Old 11-23-2011, 04:28 AM
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Default Re: Leoparding - The Discussion Continues...

That's it, wood shavings. I'm only going by what I've seen in videos and I thought it looked like sawdust, but you're 100% correct, shavings it is.
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  #36  
Old 11-23-2011, 05:51 AM
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Default Re: Leoparding - The Discussion Continues...

Managed to get some very fresh yeast today and made a French loaf to see how it compared to using IDY, so I could adjust the pizza recipe accordingly. I doubled the amount of IDY for this test. The yeast was quite active so I think I will do 1:1 with the fresh yeast for the pizza and see what happens. Pic of French loaf.. proofed for 90 mins...
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  #37  
Old 11-23-2011, 10:21 AM
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Default Re: Leoparding - The Discussion Continues...

The saw dust is a pretty traditional trick to give a quick burst of top heat. Throughout the course of the day in a commercial setting it would probably be a great trick. For a few pies at home you shouldn't need it. Also Your oven won't be heat saturated like a commercial oven, without a constant flame the floor temperature would plummet so. A quick burst of top heat on a cold floor would make for an unbalanced bake.

So long as I'm posting to this thread one more thing I noticed. In Naples they start with the water then add the salt and then the yeast. They claim the salt has a positive effect of the yeast due to osmotic pressure from the best I can gather.
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  #38  
Old 11-23-2011, 02:27 PM
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Default Re: Leoparding - The Discussion Continues...

On the floor heat .. Mine is constant but very high due to a large bed of coals. Next fire i am going to make a quick burning fire with smaller pieces of wood and see how that goes.

I always put the water in first as it seems to makes sense from a mixing point of view...
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  #39  
Old 11-27-2011, 08:36 PM
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Default Re: Leoparding - The Discussion Continues...

Hi guys.... I haven't been around for a while (learning the pizzeria business) but the subject topic caught my eye...

Rossco, as far as I can tell after having made a couple thousand pizzas (owning a pizzeria napoletana will do that to ya, I hope to reach 1000 day at some point in my life), you guys are right at 2 critical points imo:

1. somewhat overproofed dough (by forums standards.... by my standards at the correct proofing point)
2. HUGE fire going, -1 second mississipi temp test

I work everyday at an optimal floor temp of 370C with celing temps +100. If i'm making sparse margheritas for my italian customers, I can work closer to 400 floor because the pizza is very light.... With heavier pizzas, the toppings will weigh the pizza down and press it against the oven floor, and it will char at higher temps.

For leoparding to occur, insanely large fire is a must, the more convective heat the better. You really need the hot air rushing around in there like a hurricane. I have been constantly making my pizzaiolos notice the importance of having the huge fire at the moment you load the pizza in the oven. The first 30-45 seconds are the most important. Have that huge fire, and with the right dough, that's it. When I want to make proper neapolitan margheritas o marinaras, I always push for 1:15-1:30 bake time. Any longer and it wasn't hot enough.... Then I'll get whitish dough with black spots.

As for my dough, we work usually at 61% hydration with IDY (cake was a pain in the *ss), with little bulk (maybe 30 mins) and variable ball proof time (18 hrs for overnite and 9 hrs for dinner dough)... at around 0.04% and 0.16% respectively (must be re converted for cake yeast percentages).

I don't usually push for leoparding day to day, because people are used to brown/golden pizza.... But I personally love it.

cheers all
tenorio
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  #40  
Old 11-27-2011, 10:49 PM
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Default Re: Leoparding - The Discussion Continues...

Thanks for the info - it sounds like the primary culprit is the raging fire. I have a pizza session arranged for next Sunday. I have split some fast buring wood for the occasion and will forego the "coal making" process that I have been following up till now.

Just received an email from the pizza place to advise that they have ordered a 12.5 kg bag of Allied Perfection Baker's flour (12.5 protein) - see comparison chart here: http://www.dileofoods.com.au/A4%20Flour%20&%20Yeast.pdf

Will there be a noticeable difference in the "rubberyness" of the pizzas? Just wondering about the overall difference in texture etc between the Superb Baker's Flour (11%) and Perfection baker's flour at 12.5%. Perhaps someone can clarify this...
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