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From oz. First time user. Please help.

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  • From oz. First time user. Please help.

    Hi there everyone, this is my first time on the forum, so you could say Iím new at this. Iím from Adelaide, South Australia down under.

    Iím keen to build a wood fired pizza oven as most of you are or have already done so.

    Iíve been researching ovens, DIY kits all different shapes and sizes precast, clay and fire brick??? Iíve decided (I think) to build my own oven sourcing materials locally using med duty fire bricks. So I guess Iím putting my hand up for some help, to find suppliers in oz. As I see there is a wealth of knowledge here, both things that have worked and some that havenít. I have a question on thermal mass how thick is too thick? I was thinking 120 to 130mm or 4.5Ē to 5Ē dome, time you use half brick with render coat, with 75mm or3.5Ē floor, how does that sound? Please help as I just want to get this right the first time.

    Regards,

    Symon from oz.
    Last edited by symon; 07-31-2010, 04:55 AM.

  • #2
    Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

    Hi
    Im dave. Im building an oven with lighter bricks, 29 silica content and will be adding a 25 mm fireproof cement layer to the outside of this to increase the thermal mass. From what I have been able to find out so far I would not increase the thermal mass much more than this as you would have to increase the heating time ( and Wood ) required to bring the extra mass up to Temp.
    The trade of to this would be an oven that would keep it temp for a longer time, I dont need to cook doz of loaves of bread over many hours so it isnt needed.
    The important thing to consider is the insulation layer, this is needed to stop all the heat wicking away. Its little use putting all that heat in there to have it leak into the outside world and not stay in the oven and the tucker.
    You'll have to use a pearlite cement layer or a high temp insulation sheet such as "rockwool" (not your home insulation type insulation cause its only rated to 250 C.)
    If you havn't already read it check out the section in the Forno Bravo instructions on thermal mass V insulation its worth the read.

    Good luck hopes this helps

    regards Dave
    Measure twice
    Cut once
    Fit in position with largest hammer

    My Build
    http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f51/...ild-14444.html
    My Door
    http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f28/...ock-17190.html

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

      Thank's for the info Dave.

      I will look into all you mentioned and keep you posted as time goes on.

      Cheers,

      Symon.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

        Hi there, i'm a first timer myself.
        It will be a while before i start.
        Have you dowloaded the free pompeii oven plans from this site, they are a fantastic reference.
        You'll find the link, among the others, at the bottom of the homepage.
        Have fun

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

          Yes, I have the pompeii plans and they are fantastic.
          I'm looking to get started soon, just a matter of freeing up some time and money.

          Cheers,

          Symon.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

            Originally posted by cobblerdave View Post
            Hi
            Im dave. Im building an oven with lighter bricks,
            Hi Dave.
            Aren't those types of brick for insulation purposes, which would mean that they wont soak up the heat like the denser types?
            The English language was invented by people who couldnt spell.

            My Build.

            Books.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

              Hi Symon and welcome aboard.
              You make my total of 31 Adelaide members.
              Highbury hey? Not far from Hendo's place at Rostrevor!

              Iím putting my hand up for some help, to find suppliers in oz. As I see there is a wealth of knowledge here, both things that have worked and some that havenít. I have a question on thermal mass how thick is too thick?

              You might contact Thermal Ceramics at:-
              10-14 Toogood Avenue, Beverley
              SA 5009 Australia
              Tel + 61 (8) 8243 5300
              Fax: +61 (8) 8243 0571
              Email: australia@thermalceramics.com

              They have most things that you'll need and very helpful. I believe that they also now have firebricks from one of their plants in China. (They used to carry them but discontinues some years ago).

              As far as your thermal mass is concerned, a well insulated oven built from half length bricks will heat up in around an hour to an hour and a half and hold heat with the use of a well insulated and sealed door for up to 3 days.
              I can't under estimate the importance of good quality and sufficient insulation! Money well spent.
              You might contact the owner of this forum, James, for the contact details of his Australian agent who might just have the Pompeii kits available. Send him a personal email!

              Cheers.

              Neill
              Last edited by nissanneill; 08-29-2010, 05:57 AM.
              Prevention is better than cure, - do it right the first time!

              The more I learn, the more I realise how little I know


              Neillís Pompeiii #1
              http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f8/n...-1-a-2005.html
              Neillís kitchen underway
              http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f35/...rway-4591.html

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

                Hi Neill,

                Thanks again, I will look at Thermal Ceramics as a possible supplier when I get to that stage. I just want to get the footing started. Will keep you posted when I get started as I know their will be questions.

                Regards,

                Symon.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

                  Dave back again....
                  on firebricks the 29 per cent silica bricks are all that I could find locally. They are not the insulating type that you find boilers on ships that Ive seen, which are more like hebbel, light and full of air bubbles.
                  The 29 per cent bricks aint your standard common house brick they are very heavy probaby twice the weight of a common brick.
                  Ive added a 25mm layer of fire resistant cement to add to the termal mass.
                  Works.... seems to... Ive fired the oven up one night before the insulation was fitted and it took about 3 hours before the heat arrived to the outside.
                  Oven was still warm to the touch next day even though only 8 C that night sorry thats as cold as you 'll get in Bris. Cant wait till its insulated and I can extent the cooking times
                  By the way didn't waste the heat and inpressed the child bride with a Bloody nice pizza that night.
                  Regards to all
                  cobbler dave
                  Measure twice
                  Cut once
                  Fit in position with largest hammer

                  My Build
                  http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f51/...ild-14444.html
                  My Door
                  http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f28/...ock-17190.html

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

                    Sounds like you’re on the right track Dave.
                    The bricks you used may be light fire bricks with around 30% alumina content. (That said, low duty firebricks are a good choice for building a Pompeii Oven and other than considering the Pompeii Oven Kit from Forno Bravo, it is not worth the effort of trying to find a higher quality firebrick in your region.), as quoted in the Pompeii Oven Instructions. The 25mm layer to increase thermal mass sounds spot on. Go Dave!!!

                    Regards,
                    Symon.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

                      I'm fairly new to the forum, have just completed the base and insulating layer for the floor. My problem - do I fork out big $ for refractory bricks, or go with clay bricks? I got on to some solid clay bricks (enough paver thickness ones to do the base, and about 50 standard height) they are big heavy solid suckers. I have read Russel Jeavon's book where he reckons use solid red clay bricks and normal mortar and she'll still be right. He seems a bit too casual about the whole affair to me, but even in the FB downloadable instructions they state if it's red bricks or nothing, go red. Has anyone used red clay,and how do they stand the test of time?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

                        Ive built many a fire place with red bricks and they seem to stand up to constant firing.

                        Although, a pizza oven has more extreme temps so Im not sure if theyll go the distance.

                        I think they fire bricks at around 1200c which is nowhere near the temp your oven (maybe 600c) will get too.

                        The skirt in my oven is made from 50mm thick red clay pavers and they are still as good as I laid them after nearly 2 years, and we have a few parties too.
                        The English language was invented by people who couldnt spell.

                        My Build.

                        Books.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

                          I am leaning towards firebrick. The missus will not like the news (What, another $500???) but I only want to do this once. Also I'm concerned that any brick that's a few hundred degrees C on one end and room temp on the other is going to have some serious stresses on it. I'm sure if I fire it slowly and give it time to get to temp I'll reduce the risk of cracking, but really, I am confident that after a couple of drinks and the boys braying for "PIZZAAAAAA" I wont be so conscientious.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

                            Go the firebrick
                            Expensive yep, hold the heat in yep, after all the time and effort I spent on the base etc I was not going the easy option. The Forno Bravo instructions call up up to 200 bricks for a 42 inch or 110cm oven so was very tempted to complete my build with White bricks as I had read they resist the heat better. Silica content gives them the white colour. After checking out the Firebricks and remembering this is your heat bank I went for the firebricks there were so much heavier.
                            Like I said 200 bricks I brought 175 in 2 lots, used for the floor and dome but not the entrance and carfully finish up with 18 to spare so I used 157 in total.
                            There is a fireproof cement mix in the instructions containing fine sand, lime portland cement and fireclay. Fireclay is the only ingredient that is uncommon its basically ground up brick. You could use the slurry from the brick saw but you would probable need to grind up a bit? anyway a 20 kg bag cost $25 and whatever brick you could use a fireproof cement.
                            Regards
                            dave
                            Measure twice
                            Cut once
                            Fit in position with largest hammer

                            My Build
                            http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f51/...ild-14444.html
                            My Door
                            http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f28/...ock-17190.html

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: From oz. First time user. Please help.

                              Hi Worb and welcome aboard,
                              check out the pics of Russell Jeavon's oven in his restaurant which is over 6 years old and used 3 days a week cooking pizzas at:

                              http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/27/r...ia-1930-2.html

                              See permalink #16
                              Also, a brick company in the Adelaide hills who also make and sell firebricks ($5 ea) sells more solid fired clay pavers for ovens than firebricks.
                              The next oven I build will be with pavers and not firebricks.

                              Cheers.

                              Neill

                              PS Don't even think of using normal mortar as the high Portland concentration WILL NOT stand up to the heat. Use the poor man's mortar which is great
                              Prevention is better than cure, - do it right the first time!

                              The more I learn, the more I realise how little I know


                              Neillís Pompeiii #1
                              http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f8/n...-1-a-2005.html
                              Neillís kitchen underway
                              http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/f35/...rway-4591.html

                              Comment

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