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Dome Installation Video - Casa / Premio / Modena

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The differences in heatstop

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  • The differences in heatstop

    It seems the only kind of heatstop available in my area come in fifty pound pails and simply branded "Heatstop" (not heatstop 50 that I see so much on the forum). I thought I had read among the posts to stay away from the pailed product but can't find it now. Is there any real disadvantage to using the pail version of heatstop. Also in every case they are referring to heatstop as fireclay, is there a distinction?

    Any help appreciated.

    Jim

  • #2
    Re: The differences in heatstop

    Jim,

    I have the exact same problems in my area (and had the same questions).

    Fire clay is just powdered refractory clay. It is an ingredient in refractory mortar. It won't set, it's just clay. Pro mason's will often buy bags of fireclay and mix their own mortar for doing fireplaces (you can use fireclay to mix your own oven mortar as well). The ladies that answer the phones at the brick yards don't understand the difference and just see the masons driving off with bags of fire clay; so they figure it must be mortar. You need to get past the receptionist and talk to a sales manager.

    Heat Stop:
    There are two kinds of Heat Stop. The wet stuff in the buckets and the 50lb bags of DRY stuff (Heat Stop 50). You want the DRY stuff. The dry is non water soluble after it sets (perfect for our ovens). The wet stuff doesn't completely set until it gets hot and IS water soluble (not good for outdoor applications).

    Call the place that carries the buckets of Heat Stop and INSIST that you need "HeatStop 50, the dry product in the 50 lb bags". They may not have ever seen it and they might not be familiar with it. They will likely have to order it for you. I finally convinced the sales manager at Boral Bricks here in Louisville that I wasn't crazy and he made some calls. ALAS, he was able to order it from the same place he gets the buckets. I was the first person to ask for the stuff.

    The down side is that it's $80/bag once it gets to the store. If you are quoted more, contact these people:

    HeatStop

    They will find the dealer in your area and get it to you for $70-85/bag. I ordered 2 bags and it looks like that might do it for me.

    Here are the dealers in WI:
    Rumford Dealers

    Call the ones closest to you and push them a bit until they soften up and check on the price.

    Good luck and let us know how it goes!
    Ken H. - Kentucky
    42" Pompeii

    Pompeii Oven Construction Video Updated!

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    • #3
      Re: The differences in heatstop

      $80/bag! Ouch! You may also want to consider the RefMix in the FornoBravoStore. I was able to get two bags plus shipping for under $100. The two bags should be more than enough for me since my joints are only about 2-3mm.
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      • #4
        Re: The differences in heatstop

        Originally posted by rlf5 View Post
        $80/bag! Ouch! You may also want to consider the RefMix in the FornoBravoStore. I was able to get two bags plus shipping for under $100. The two bags should be more than enough for me since my joints are only about 2-3mm.
        2 bags of RefMix + shipping for me is $217.83. So I'm better off with the overpriced HeatStop. The farther you are from CA, the higher the $hipping .

        Also, if Jim calls all the Rumford Dealers in his area, he might get lucky and stumble on one that normally carries Heat Stop 50. If it's a regular item, it may only be around $50/bag.
        Ken H. - Kentucky
        42" Pompeii

        Pompeii Oven Construction Video Updated!

        Oven Thread ... Enclosure Thread
        Cost Spreadsheet ... Picasa Web Album

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        • #5
          Re: The differences in heatstop

          Originally posted by Ken524 View Post
          2 bags of RefMix + shipping for me is $217.83. So I'm better off with the overpriced HeatStop. The farther you are from CA, the higher the $hipping .

          Also, if Jim calls all the Rumford Dealers in his area, he might get lucky and stumble on one that normally carries Heat Stop 50. If it's a regular item, it may only be around $50/bag.
          Ken

          I think I"m actually farther than you, and my shipping was only 25 or 30 dollars for the two bags. I know its too late now but if you ever get crazy high shipping charges then its probably due to an error in their program. I had the same problem with the SuperIsol boards. Three boards came to $210 in shipping charges...giving a total of $405. I called and it turns out the shipping was really only $25. The program takes the size and weight and makes an estimate, but its not always right. The RefMix is really good stuff and its specifically made for ovens if that makes any difference.
          Oven Progress
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          • #6
            Re: The differences in heatstop

            Heat Stop is a brand name. Their signature product, a refractory mortar, comes in 10 pound pails, called Heat-Stop, and fifty pound bags, called Heat-Stop 50. They also make a wet pre-mixed product which is completely different and you want to stay away from. Years ago when I did my fireplace in the house, the fifty pound containers of heat stop came in pails instead of bags. Your dealer may have old stock. Check if it's a powder - the lid comes right off.



            Fire clay is something completely different, and way cheaper.
            My geodesic oven project: part 1, part 2

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            • #7
              Re: The differences in heatstop

              Ken,
              Call Tammy on the main 800 407 5119 line, and see if there is anything she can do about the shipping charges. It might be the e-store software mis-calculating the cost. That seems high, and it would be a lot better to use Refmix if we can get it to you at a competitive cost. That's the plan, and why we import a lot of it.
              James
              Pizza Ovens
              Outdoor Fireplaces

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              • #8
                Re: The differences in heatstop

                Originally posted by james View Post
                Ken,
                It might be the e-store software mis-calculating the cost. That seems high, and it would be a lot better to use Refmix if we can get it to you at a competitive cost.
                James,

                I bought 2 bags of Heat Stop 2 weeks ago. I didn't bother checking with you guys because I trusted your shipping charge calculator. I also would have bought your SuperIsol instead of the overpriced, disintegrating Kaowool boards, but again, the shipping charges on your site made it prohibitive ($296.50 to ship 4 panels to Kentucky).

                I really believe the errors in your system are what is causing so many threads about alternative mortar products. PLEASE fix your shipping calculator (your sales will probably go up).
                Ken H. - Kentucky
                42" Pompeii

                Pompeii Oven Construction Video Updated!

                Oven Thread ... Enclosure Thread
                Cost Spreadsheet ... Picasa Web Album

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: The differences in heatstop

                  Originally posted by Ken524 View Post
                  James,

                  I bought 2 bags of Heat Stop 2 weeks ago. I didn't bother checking with you guys because I trusted your shipping charge calculator. I also would have bought your SuperIsol instead of the overpriced, disintegrating Kaowool boards, but again, the shipping charges on your site made it prohibitive ($296.50 to ship 4 panels to Kentucky).

                  I really believe the errors in your system are what is causing so many threads about alternative mortar products. PLEASE fix your shipping calculator (your sales will probably go up).
                  Very true. Thats the ONLY reason I didn't get the boards from here. By the time I found out that the shipping program was miscalculating I had already bought the boards I have now from the local refractory supply. I had the same problem with the refmix, but I tried again and it gave me the very reasonable cost of $20 shipping, so I jumped on it. I missed out on the boards, but they'll get plenty of repeat business from me when it comes time for the chimney, pizza tools, cookware, flour, etc....
                  Oven Progress
                  Bread Photos
                  Oven Stand Thread

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                  • #10
                    Re: The differences in heatstop

                    Thanks all for your feedback! And Ken thanks for your help, research and leads. I ran down each on in my area and still no HeatStop50. I did run across a product among your leads called FireRock mortar. It is an outdoor refractory mortar that ships with FireRock fireplaces (Fire Rock Manufacturing, Inc. :: FIRE ROCK MASONRY FIREPLACES AND OUTDOOR FIREPLACES) for installation and has recently been offered unbundled from their fireplaces. 25 lb. bags at $23.65 per. Any one have any experence with the product.

                    I gave the Forno Bravo store another try given the comments above; 3 bags to Wisconsin $360+ for shipping. Haven't been able to raise anyone by phone to verify as of yet.

                    Jim

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                    • #11
                      Re: The differences in heatstop

                      Hey all,

                      We have identified the problem, and we are working on it. Basically, the e-store freight calculator is being confused between lighter items, such as accessories, and the heavier pizza ovens. Right now, the instalation accessory weights are putting them into the pizza oven freight category -- which is resulting in the wrong shipping costs.

                      At this point, I can only say that it's a problem and we are working on it. Sorry about that.

                      In the meanwhile, if you are looking for the correct (and much lower) shipping cost, call our main line (800 407 5119) and press the buttons either for oven sales (Tammy) or accessories (Krista), and they will get the right cost for you.

                      Again, sorry about our mistake. We will get this fixed right away. We definitely want to be the best choice for installation equipment.

                      More to come.
                      James
                      Pizza Ovens
                      Outdoor Fireplaces

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: The differences in heatstop

                        Well, my search is ended. I spoke to Krista (extension 3), and as a result have 7 bags of Refmix winging its way to Wisconsin. Should be here in 4 business days.

                        Thanks!!!

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